NPA drops Zuma charges cartoon

NPA drops Zuma charges

NPA drops Zuma charges and liberates South Africa

This week the National Prosecuting Authority (NPA) headed by Mokotedi Mpshe dropped corruption charges against ANC president Jacob Zuma. This hopefully and finally ends the saga of the meaningless trial of Jacob Zuma. No doubt the opposition DA and Helen Zille will be objecting till the cows come home from the ANC parties this week – no doubt trying to highlight the fact that matters of South African national security have been infringed by Jacob Zuma’s legal team by them illegally gaining access to wire tap recordings of ex-South African president Thabo Mbeki and other senior politicians. But that won’t matter because of some constitutional right or other of Mr Zuma so Wonkie is not concerned.

Wonkie is particularly glad no more hard earned South African tax payer money will be spent battling against an inevitable outcome. Tax payer money can, and now probably will, be more effectively spent by the ANC to ensure that NPA’s Bulelani Ngcuka, Leonard McCarthy and other non-believers and blasphemers such as Archbishop Desmond Tutu will be put in their place.

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Comments

  1. The only thing that bugs me about Zuma’s charges being dropped is the raft of nonsensical bilge we now have to listen to about how the taint of getting off untried is going to follow him for the rest of his political life. I mean, come on! Those who support him really don’t care. By the way, Wonkie, your cartoon is almost too clever for the appreciation of a newcomer. I refer specifically to the final panel. Semaj.

  2. Hi. I read a few of your other posts and wanted to know if you would be interested in exchanging blogroll links?

  3. Imagine what this is going to do to overseas investment confidence. Who is going to want to invest in a country with a corrupt judicial system and and even more corrupt Head of State. But what do JZ and his minions care? I doubt they know much about economics anyway.

  4. myron betshanger says:

    The cartoon is brilliant, however, your written comment about the likes of Ngcuka and McCarthy is pre-emptive, without substance or proof. Did you yourself have first hand access to the alleged recordings. Furthermore, why do you think Adv. Mokotedi “pontius pilate” Mpshe only read selected extracts of the alleged recordings? To justify his spineless and not really legal decision to drop charges and so secure his pay-cheque for the next five years at least. READ THE WHOLE STATEMENT.

  5. Totally awesome best to date. Two pics tell the whole sorry saga.
    VIVA SAZIM – we learnt well.
    Motsepe and 21 other brethren in Zim to colonise the mines.
    That was the reason for “No crisis “YET” ” – let it happen and reap the spoils. BEE in action bru.

    Give us a cartoon on this Expeditionary Force into Zim to annexe for the Chinese Masters.

  6. myron betshanger says:

    If Adv. Mokotedi “Pontius Pilate” has any spine he will not refer the matter to the Minister of Justice, President or any other person or body but should decide himself whether Adv. Leonard McCarthy, Mr. Ngcuka and others should be criminally charged. Why does he have the spine and guts to accuse Adv. McCarthy of, in Mpshe’s own word “an intolerable abuse of the legal system”, but can not himself take the decision to bring charges against the gentleman. Only illustrating the baselessness of the allegations and the illegality by which the alleged recordings were obtained. This means that the charges won’t stand in a court of law because Section 35 (5) of the Constitution 1996 clearly provides that evidence obtained in violation of any right in the Bill of Rights is inadmissible as evidence if that evidence will render the trial unfair or otherwise be detrimental to the administration of justice, and “pilate” Mpshe knows it.

  7. HAHA! Nice one guys!

    Semaj – a friend thankfully forwarded me a link to Wonkie a couple weeks ago so am a relative newcomer… hmmm… it is maybe too subtle but I don’t think too many thinking people are going to miss the banana republic reference! I have to laugh otherwise it’s all going to make me cry!

  8. myron betshanger says:

    Question: What will South Africa in the near future have in commen with Zimbabwe and Uganda?

    An Ape of a President. Viva Jacob”Idi Amin” Zuma

  9. precious says:

    The catoon is great, keep up the good work!

  10. Nhlanhla says:

    To Myron & Antiaa comments:
    The majority of South Africans have long agreed that the persecution of Mr. Zuma was magnified by a small coterie of elite white journalists who are hell bent on humilating and degrading him. We have known all along that there was an outside influence in the persecution and prosecution of Mr. Zuma. It is on the basis of the aforesaid that the ANC will win the upcoming elections with majority vote. People of SA are not blind as you think.
    The NPA is constitutionally the only state organ that has the power to decide to charge or not to charge without any undue influence. I humble request you to accept that comrade Jacob Gedleyihlekisa Zuma will be your president, deal with it and stop being holier than Jesus Christ himself, who preached forgiveness at all times.

  11. myron betshanger says:

    sorry mike harmon, but to who is your request addressed?

  12. Thanks for the comments everyone – please keep ’em coming

    @Semaj – I’m sure Mr Zuma will give the DA and South Africans plenty of other material to keep everyone entertained. Hopefully when Mr Zuma begins his third presidential term most people will have forgotten about this whole unfortunate episode.

    @Antiaa – erm.. corruption? What corruption? If foreign direct investment (FDI) declines as a result of this decision then the only logical conclusion is that the imperialist pigs of the west are all in with the dark forces on the smear campaign against Mr Zuma.

    @Myron Betshanger – Thanks and great to get your comment. I do believe we’re roughly on the same page though. Rabid sarcasm continuing, Wonkie doesn’t particularly care about the content of the tapes or how they were obtained. Wonkie doesn’t care that due process is not being followed, nor that the future head of state will be controlling the very checks and balances to ensure he is kept on the straight and narrow. Wonkie is just sincerely happy that finally Mr Zuma will stop being victimised by the cruel and evil dark forces now.

    @Ou Vrou – tsk, tsk – you’re so very cynical. I’ll bet you’re just bitter because you wanted your photo taken with Dalai Lama. LOL .. and thanks for the cartoon idea… very good one actually – we’ll do some research and come up with something – watch this space!

    @Mike Harmon – thanks but I don’t think accounting related subjects are really in line with this blog to be blogrolled. Feel free to add Wonkie though if your readers need some comic relief

    @precious – thanks!

  13. myron betshanger says:

    Nhlanhla
    Thankfully I do still have certain choices and one of the is not to allow a person like Zuma to dictate my choices, maybe yours, but not mine.
    Secondly, don’t ever try to equit Zuma with Christ, its secrelage and might find you on the wrong side of His wrath.
    Thirdly, I feel sorry for the short sighted morons such as yourself, who are blinded by individuals who have in the past been at the center of controversy and whose leadership are of questionable character. Desmond Tutu has done more for this country than any of you hop-along-for-tender boys will ever be able to do. And when your child one day circum to drug addiction or be the victim of gang violence or any of your relatives of friends raped or robbed please remember your e-mail.

    Only after many years of suffering did both the Ugandans and now the Zimbabweans realised the monsters they handed power to. What make South Africa different, nothing I tell you as was aptly demonstrated by the NPA’ decision yesterday

  14. Lekgotla says:

    The cardinal discipline at play in Zuma’s case remains that of Politics, not Law or Morality. The political process involves mobilising and wielding power. If, in the process of wielding power that has been successfully mobilised (in Polokwane and elsewhere), one decides to exploit weaknesses in procedural law or influence interpretation of “fairness” of judicial process in one’s favour, or even obtain clandestinely tapes containing wicked plots by the enemy camp, it is all fair game in politics. Civil society, that is, the general public, is faced with serious constraints in dealing with the matter because of a persistent attempt to position Law or Morality as the point of reference. (It’s like playing drafts when the other player is playing chess on the same board!!). With a bit of mind shift, more people should understand and use political methodology to reign in politicians. The saga surely marks the beginning of the end of naive politics in South Africa. Why do you think in mature democracies the contract of the Attorney-General (equivalnet of NPA chief) is linked to presdiential terms or why the appointment of consitutional judges is such a hot electoral issue? It is because maturity in the politics has shown that Law and Morality are not impartial or neutral. They are subject to the political process. There is hope in SA if we can learn from the whole episode to move towards maturity of public institutions as the lowest common denominator for protecting everyopne’s interests as intended by the consitution. Maturity includes prosecutrs and the Ngcukas not giving cause in procedural law for dropping of criminal charges against anyone

  15. Play it like the proverbial duck, Myron, and let Nhlanhla wash off your back. The only trouble is that he represents the thinking of masses that will see to it that “the Zoom” is up there for years. Nothing can be done about it. The only hope is that his party loses its two-thirds majority. Semaj.

  16. Ha ha, so clever Sizwe, you should have been twins. LOL

  17. @Lekgotla – very well put and Wonkie certainly does not fault Mr Zuma for playing to win – he is using all the tools he has at his disposal and quite effectively so. Whether or not this is in the best interests of South Africa is another matter. I agree with you though – if South Africans allow this precedent to be set now it will seriously affect the checks and balances system required for a mature democracy.

    @myron – good point but easy on the name-calling please – Nhlanhla is entitled to his views. Attack the issue not the person, otherwise Wonkie will be seen to be competing with our national political parties! 😉

    @Antiaa – LOL! The world is not big enough!

  18. gillkitty says:

    Amazing how radio 702 has become a target for Zuma followers.
    Anyone noticed how many calls go thru calling Redi Direko and Kieno Kammies ( as well as PrimeMedia) blatantly anti ANC and pro DA?

    It’s laughable.. and also a sad commentary of our bitter nation

  19. Yeah Sizwe, heaven help us if it was. LOL

  20. myron betshanger says:

    Nhlanhla
    Retracting calling you a morone, but short sighted you are non the less. Except for the whole contoversy surrounding Zuma and some highly placed ANC officials, there is still the matter of the unresolved issues in ANC military camp where cadres as well as potential political opponents allegedly went missing and for which there is until today no satisfactory answer given.
    Don’t you think that people like myself, who dare to hold an opposing view, might not coveniently dissappear?
    Secondly, if you look at people such as Jessie Duarte, Matthew Phosa, Ramahlodi, Toni Yengheni, they all served under the Mandela administration and were all relieved of their duties under a cloud of either mis/mal-administration or suspicion of corruption. Surely speaking, some of us but not all might have the memory of a fish. By the way, a fish have a proven memory span of less than three seconds. You can repeatedly catch the same fish with the same hook and bait every three seconds after the last time it got caught. See why I call your vision short-sighted.

  21. myron betshanger says:

    Lekgotla. point well stated, however, I have a serious reservation with regard to your statement. As I interpret it, it means that Politics at present day influence Law and Morality which should, according to my view and the purported spirit and objects of the Constitution be the other way around. If politics were to undermine the rule of law, then surely speaking one cannot have a Constitutional Democracy within which the Constitution is the Supreme Law of the Land. Which again implies that Parliament or some other polit body (Lithuli House perhaps) are Supreme and that our courts are thus also divested of its Constitutional powers to review on the constitutionality or otherwise of any executive conduct such as yesterday’s decision by the NPA.

  22. bakenshark says:

    The tongue must be firmly be glued into that cheek Sizwe!..do stop making us laugh at these most serious matters!! :-p Excellent toon!..the truth is as elusive as the head of Kaglema Mothlante! Thankfully, it is at times like these you can be sure of the flaring up of Zille’s objectionitis!

  23. myron betshanger says:

    Just realised that yesterday was a very important day for the Afrikaners, namely “Van Riebeeck-dag” 06 April 1652. Perhaps we should rename it to “ZUMA or KANGAMAN – Day” and declare it a public holiday because it seemed like many people in any event either stayed home or went home to celebrate after the NPA’s announcement yesterday.

    Viva “ZUMA-DAY” nice ring to it, don’t it

  24. Lekgotla says:

    @ myron betshanger – Whilst I state that the cardinal discipline at play is Politics, I do not believe that politik should be overriding Law and Morality. What I wish to indicate (and possibly did not do so clearly) is that we need to understand how real politik works in order to deal effectively with political manipulation of law and morality (some even say JZ is “holy”). A key aspect in dealing with politics is to have interventions for rapidly migrating institutions that are intended to protect the constitutional rights of all citizens towards maturity. Episodes such as Zuma’s case should propel the nation to act in that direction. This is in recognition of the fact that Politics will always be at play, irrespective of civil society’s desire to have law and morality as the main point of reference for an orderly and stable society.

  25. Thanks man! I had a good laugh at this one. Have a banana, I know I am.

  26. myron betshanger says:

    Lekgotla thanx for providing clarity. I still think that the anger of the NPA are misdirected and whether the “recordings” trully existed is a question that begs answers especially in the lite of an intellegence community that are as unprofessional as the ‘anties that stands at the fence with packets of Lexington in their mouths and gossipping still wearing last nights pj’s” If you know what I mean. Any case, wonder did they notice the markable increase of Parkistani nationals into the country, especially so close to major sporting events?

  27. hahahaaa.What a funny joke there…really enjoyed it.

    This “behind the scenes” deal is far from over…If the DA`s funds don`t slump it will succeed in having this matter reviewed and eventually overturned since the admissibility of the tapes evidence is in question here until it has been clarified that these tapes were legally and lawfully procurred.

    If the tapes were illegally aqcuired bhy Zuma`s lawyers then Mpshe should instead have them arrested for being accessory to theft or direct theft.Even if this whole deal was done to the letter of the law it still doesn`t impresses one to decide to vote for the ANC since its a technical thing that doesn`t absolve him from the very serious and damaging charges.

    Again,he did not got aqcuitted on the rape charge but it was another tecdnicality where he called for the dismissal of the case not charges because the head of investigations did not treat him constitutionally and in both these acquittals its that the case is involved not the charges.The case has been removed from the court roll meaning that charges can be reinstated automatically .

    Its ridiculous that an accused person can threaten prosecution authority with instability if the case is not withdrawn and succeed since in other democracies this could have led to charges since the person who is making such threats has it in his capacity to cause insta\bility.I will go around with begging bowls raising funds for the DA and i hope all those who appreciate the good work the DA did in the last ten years of watchdog will keep its coffers full.

  28. Xolani P says:

    Watching the NPA’s press conference was sobering, not so much for the decision it communicated, but for the information it laid plain about the extent of political manipulation of our legal processes.
    So tainted was the case against ANC President Jacob Zuma that Mpshe felt he had no option but to drop the charges and halt the prosecution. It was clearly a difficult decision, taken after careful consideration of the law and the demands of justice.
    Zuma has maintained his innocence throughout, and has long complained that the investigation and prosecution were politically motivated. Despite this, he has submitted himself to the legal process, offering cooperation and appearing in court as required. He has also availed himself of those legal remedies he considered necessary to protect his rights.
    He has never asked for special treatment; only to be accorded the same rights as any other citizen, and to be treated in a fair and even-handed manner. Long before Mpshe made his announcement this week, it should have been clear to all but the most blinkered observer that this had not been the case. This was borne out by earlier findings of the Public Protector and the judgement of Judge Nicholson in the Pietermaritzburg High Court last year.
    The information that has come to light about the alleged activities of Leonard McCarthy and Bulelani Ngcuka should be a matter of grave concern to all South Africans who value a law-governed society, in which legal institutions are able to perform their functions without fear or favour.

  29. The NPA’s decision to drop the charges was greeted, for the most part, with delight and celebration across the country. This was understandable. But this celebration was tinged with regret and anger; regret that the institutions of our young democracy had been manipulated in this way, and anger at what Zuma and his family had to go through over the better part of the last decade.
    This has been a divise and traumatic experience for the ANC, that has been felt across society, which, it now seems, was neither necessary nor warranted. We have to move forward as a nation, the challenge we face as a country is to learn the lessons of this experience.
    The first of these is that we should not rush to judgement. Within the media, and among certain sections of society, Zuma was tried and found guilty a long time ago. His complaints of a political conspiracy were taken simply as the desperate measures of someone trying to escape justice. So too were the court actions he brought to protect his rights.
    The second lesson is that state institutions need to be scrupulous in the implementation of their mandate, free from ulterior motive, or external interference. In short, they need to do things by the book. It will take some time for the NPA to recover from this crisis of confidence. Its credibility has been badly undermined, and its integrity deeply affected.

  30. Isaac Plaatjies says:

    In some ways, the recovery of the NPA has already begun. The NPA’s open admission of the problem is a step in the right direction. We should welcome the manner in which Mpshe explained his decision, laying bare both his reasoning and the information that he had received – and revealing the discussions that had taken place within the NPA and the different views held.

    Another lesson to be learnt is that those individuals who occupy positions of responsibility in state institutions must be accountable first and foremost to the Constitution, the law and the mandate of their institutions. Their background, political affiliation or other associations should not be allowed to cloud their judgement.
    This is a discipline that we need to inculcate in all individuals who occupy such positions. We must accept that involvement in the struggle is neither a qualification for, nor a disqualification from, being appointed to such office. We must resist the calls of those, like the Democratic Alliance, who would deny freedom fighters the opportunity to serve in such positions. The issue is not what a person did in the struggle, nor what party they support today, but how they act when in office.
    There needs to be adequate oversight of all state institutions. In his response to the withdrawal of the charges, Zuma called for the oversight role of Parliament to be strengthened, and said that the findings and recommendations of Chapter 9 institutions like the Public Protector needed to be taken seriously and acted upon.
    The NPA would also need to look at its own internal monitoring and oversight mechanisms. And while we’re at it, we should also beef up the capacity of the office of the Inspector-General on Intelligence and the Independent Complaints Directorate, which investigates complaints of misconduct by the police.

  31. The decision to drop the charges was not universally welcomed. Those parties that had set up the prosecution of Zuma as the main plank of their electoral platform (like the DA) are clearly upset.
    There are media players who have quite literally made their living off this case. And there are legal experts (and non-experts) who would have reached a conclusion different to Mpshe.
    But the reality is that the NDPP has been given the power and responsibility to decide whether or not to prosecute a case. He has exercised that decision, consistent with the law and the Constitution.
    As South Africans we will need to accept that decision; draw what lessons we can from this experience; and move on to build the kind of society in which all South Africans can live in peace, free from want, and secure in their rights.

  32. Actually I shouldn`t be partaking in this debate since it is long-overdue for the simple reasdon that we,should have pushed for a law that stipulates that ;people with dirt of any nature whatsoever should never be allowed into the political arena.The fact that this ruling party is fraught witih people with dirt it should long have been isolated.

    We make so much noise about America but we are not learning from it since we forgot that Obama lmost was forced out of the race due to old personal dirt which had nothing to do with his political carreer.

    This latest revelation that Mpshe plagiarised another judge`s judgement coupled with his declairing classified tapes in the wrong hands admissible has automatically overturne hs decision and made the cse of the DA much easy to conclude.

    His actionsd were nefarious,vexatious and frivolous and deemed him unfit to hold that position.His first task should have to request proof fom Hulley tht he has permission to be in possession of those tapes and since he did not have it Mpshe should have charged him for being privy to sensitive and classified ino.

  33. Food parcels for ANC votes refer: there was recently a local Vaal Triangle newspaper report about how queues for free food parcels were disrupting the Meyerton town centre. What struck me was how the ANC rejected with contempt the uncharitable suggestion that the dispensing of the parcels to masses of people – some of them eating pricey takeaways as they waited – was in any way connected to the the imminent April 22 election. Semaj.

  34. @ Tim, the DA had a convicted fraudster on their national list, whilst the ID had a convicted murderer on theirs. The ANC is not unique.
    It common knowlege that in the business of court room procedures, it is acceptable to quote from related cases and or judgements. This is an accepted practice, and is nothing new. Mpshe only didnt cite the source, thats all. And this ommission still doesnt nullify the abuse of process by previous NPA bosses with their ulterior motive of bringing JZ down. This still doesnt nullify the political conspiracy against JZ.
    The DA has no case at all, they have nothing to offer to the voters, they just say people must vote for them to stop ZUMA. Now that is surely a waisted vote!
    At first people said we must proof our conspiracy theory, but now that we do so by producing the tapes, people just shift the goal posts to how did we get the tapes. The conspiracy has been proven, that is what you said we must do. Now why do you keep on shifting the goal posts?
    For your information, the NIA confirmed that the tapes were DECLASSIFIED.

  35. The DA and ID hadfraudsters and convicted people in their midst but now they don`t have them because they heeded the call of their elctorate to remove them whereas the ruling party is laden with murderers of children,fraudsters,thieves,deceptive people because they don`t have a rule that once their executive members are embroiled in scandals and crimes they must step down or be suspended like the DA.

    If you voted for material benefits I did not but for the party to ensure that taxpayers money is used responsibly and accountably and when th DA exposed thearms deal corruption they were fulfilling my mandate.

    Here we are taklking about the falling of state material into a citizen`s hands whereas the law is quite clear on this one that to axcquire such sensitive matter he should have applied to the NPA or court and he has not done so nor has he or the NPA explained how these tapes were acquired and currently this acquiring of these tapes is a subject of investigation by the NPA.

    This means the NPA never defebnded him and state material can only be declassified in terms of repealing the laws that protects them not at someones behest.

  36. I agree with you Tim. How often haven’t ANC MP’s and Ministers been found abusing their privileges, submitting fraudulent S&T claims, etc etc etc, but nothing gets done about it so they carry on regardless.
    The most disturbing feature of it all however, is that the SA electorate and more specifically the ANC supporters seem to be quite happy about this and accept it as the norm and their right. These sentiments, I might add, have been posted on numerous SA news forums that I have read over the last few years

  37. These tapes never belonged to the NPA, Tim. They were the property of NIA. NIA confirmed that the tapes were recorded during their investigation into the browse mole report. The tapes has since been declassified. The NPA, in listening to these recordings, had to go to NIA to listen to the tapes. The NPA never had the tapes, and still does’nt have them. It is the property of NIA. And NIA has declassified it recently.
    Another correction is that the arms deal was not discovered by the DA, but by Patricia De lill.
    I know you would want to polish the profile of the DA a little bit, but please do it on their merits. They are just reactionaries who are so quiet on issues like affirmative action, land redistribution etc, for very obvious reasons of course! And we know why! But yet they are trying to get black votes, interesting isnt it?

  38. Bobo, why don’t you give it a rest. I think we are all tired now of you spouting you ANC propaganda on this forum.

  39. The National Intelligence Agency is not for crime but National Security and that`s wh we have the National Crime Intelligence,nincompoop!

    Since when ha this arms deal investigation ben passed from th National Prosecuting AUTHORITY to NIA AND WH IS I THAT THERE`S NT A SINGLE NIA OPERATIVE FATURING IN THESE TAPESBUT NIA PEOPLE.MPSHE WA SUPPOSE TO HAVE INTERROGATE THE CONTENTS OF TH TAPE O STISFY HIMSELF THAT ITS NOT A HOAX -HE DI NOT DO THAT BECAUSE HE WAS LOOKING FO A SCAPEGOAT TO RELEASE ZUMA AND THIS TAPE CAME HANDY

    LOOK-MAN,YOU CAN WHINE AND WHINGE AS MUCH A OU LIKE THERE`S NO TURNING BACK RIGHT NOW BUT A FIGHT TO THE END TO SEE ZUMAAND THE REST OF THOSE ARMS DEAL HOODLMS IN COURT.

    OUR MANDATE TO MPSHE WAS THT IF THER GOING TO ENTER INTO A DEAL THAT WILL LEAD TO ALL CHARGES AGAINST ZUMA DROPPED IT MUST ENAI ZUMA RELINQUISHING HIS PARTY`S PRESIDENCY AND NOT CMPAIGNING FOR THE COUNTRY`SPRSIDENCY.MPSHE CONNIVED WITH ULLEY TO RELEASE THESE TAPES WITH THE INNTION TO ABSOLVEZUMA AN HE SHOULD BE CHARGED UNDE THE OMMON PURPOSE CRIMES LAWS.

    I DON`T LIKE ZILLE BECAUSE I FEEL SHE`S AN EAST GERMAN GERMAN BUT THE ISSUE IS NOT ABOUT HER BUT HER PARTY.I HAS DEMONSTRATED WHAT “WATCHDOG”MEANS AND HAS BEEN A REAL THREAT TO THE ANC HENCE THE ANC`s ATTEMPT TO DIVIDE IT BY GIVING O DAPOLITICIANS AMBASSADORIAL POSITIONS ABROAD WHEN IT COMES TO A GOVERNMENT ITS ALL ABOUT PATRIOCY AND NOT SKIN=COLUR,IDEOLOGIES OR AGENDAS.

    THERE ARE BLACK AMERICANS WHO DOESN`T CARE ABOUT THE KIN COLOUR OF THIR PRESIDENTS BUT ABOUT NATIONAL SECURITY,ECONOMY,JOBS AND SAFET.

    • Tim – thanks for the comment and we appreciate the opportunity to read your point of view. I would ask you to please refrain from calling each other names though (viz. your nincompoop reference) – we don’t want to sink to the level of some of our political leaders on this forum.

      A question for you, and we’re likely going to put a poll up on this point on Wonkie soon – if Helen Zille were to step down and the DA were to reposition itself with a representative black leadership team, then would you consider voting for them? I mean based on their intentions and policies with the racial issue aside? It seems that despite a large number of voters, regardless of race, not being happy with the current ANC antics with regard to Mr Zuma, there still doesn’t seem to be a credible alternative to vote for – what is missing here?

  40. PM! tHE QUESTION OF ZILLE PAINS ME A GREAT DEAL STEMMING FROM WHITE WOMEN EXPERIENCES IN THE PAST IN THE HANDS OF THEIR MILITARISTIC MEN HOWEVER WE LEAVE IT AT THAT.

    YOU SEE! TS DUE TO PRINCIPLES AND CONSCIENCE THAT I`M REFRAINING FROM VOTING SO AS NOT TO BE A HYPOCRIT.NOW,ON THE QUESTION OF SERVICE DELIVERY,GOOD ECONOMIC GOVERNNCE,RULE OF LAW,NATIONAL SECURITY,SOCIAL SECURITY,ACCOUBNTABILITY AND TRANSPARENCY THE DA IS HIGHLY RATED AND LOWLY RATED ON ITS HUMAN RIGHTS RECORD WHICH IS VERY POOR.

    SO…UNDER DA RULE I WILL BE ABLE TO HAV E A COUNTRY I CAN BE PROUD OF BECAUSE WE WILL BE TALKING ABOUT 6 TO 8% GDP THAT WILL ENABLE JOB CREATION BUT WILL NOW BE FACED WITH THE QUESTION OF NOT ENJOYING MY HUMAN RIGHTS AND FREEDOM OF MOVEMENT AS IS THE CASE IN DA RULED MUNICIPALITIES LIKE SUNNYSIDE WHERE I GET ACCOSTED BY COPS;TOLD I`M DRUNK AND LOCKED-UP FOR FOUR HOURS OR CAPETOWN WHERE I`M TOLD I`M THE ONE WHO JUST ROBBED A BLONDE OR BRUNETTE TOURIST AND LOCKED-UP.THIS THEREFORE LEAVES ME IN A QUANDARY AS TO WHAT TO DO SINCE UNDER ANC RULE I LIVED UNDER APARTHEID AND SLUM,DECAY,CRIME AND GRIME AND SINCE UNDER DA RULE ITS ONLY THE QUESTION OF HUMAN RIGHTS I SEE IT AS THE LESSER DEVIL AND SO WILL FIGHT FOR IT TO GET THE TWO-THIRDS BY CAMPAIGNING FOR IT AS HARD AS I CAN.

    THE OTHER ADVANTAGE IS THAT WHTE GOVERNMENTS CAN EASILY BE FOUGHT BUT NOT SO WITH BLACK GOVERNMNTS WHO JUST SIT AND DARED ALL TO DO THEIR DAMNDEST SO VOTING FOR ANY BLACK PARTIES ITS OUT OF THE QUESTION FOR ME.

  41. I am not prepared to get into a political debate, but Tim, I have to disagree with you. If you do not agree with the ruling party, you should still cast your vote and regard it as a protest vote Even if it is for a party with which you do not entirely agree. The purpose is to try and keep the majority of the ruling party down to a minimum and build a stronger oppostion.

  42. You make a poin ther Attiaa…remembering that Zille won the Capetown Municipality with just two votes…however I`m convinced that my abstaining will not be aloss since I WILL find someone who was not gonna vote to vote in my place.

    What is at stake here is the importancy of my principles which dictates that i mst not back that which i don`t agree with as i don`t pay taxes to this govenment by tuning mself into jobles tramp and for me to write to a political prty and not receive a response i see that as an effrontery and so cannot endorse such party.

    For me it doesn`t matter who wins I`m still going o leave this country since what is important to me its my human righs and constitutional freedoms and these won`t be guaranteed under da rule.

  43. Yep Tim, with an attitude like that, perhaps it is better that you leave the country. I wish you only the best and hope that you find whatever it is you are looking for wherever it is in the world that you decide to go

  44. yes..to have a government but looking lik you don`t have a government because yo must do the work of the government while they enjoy your taxes you don`t belonng.to leave its also a healing exercise sinc it detraumatise one since living n this country you get terribly traumatized and stressed.

  45. Well Tim, as I said before that I wish you well. In many ways, I must say I rather envy you as I am unable to leave due to various reasons. One of them being that I am now of an age where I wouldn’t get employment and without employment I don’t have the financial resources to live in any 1st world country.

  46. Lekgotla says:

    Just an aboservation of the fact that we often overlook the things that unite us due to the emotions surrounding the divisive issues. For instance, Mugabe and Zille share at leat 4 charatceristics:

    1. They are both African and (reportedly) strongly believe in African unity
    2. Both were (reportedly) strongly against apartheid
    3. They lead the minority parties in their respective legislatures
    and, you guessed it…
    4. They both use Botox

    If one dug a little more, we would find more subtle similarities. So, let’s not be quick to be driven by our diffenreces when we can explore common purpose!!!

  47. Response to Tim’s admission that if he was not an economic prisoner of SA due to age and employability, he might leave, was singularly uncharitable. I think many older people who were in a position to escape would probably head for the hills. The only difference is that most people who feel that way would keept it quiet. Point is probably that leaving’s not the issue. It’s whether one has a choice. It’s always easy for someone who has a choice to criticuse those who don’t – and sound terribly patriotic while they’re doing it. Semaj.

  48. Semaj, it wasn’t Tim it was me.

  49. By the way Semaj, if you had read the posts carefully you would have seen that Tim is the one leaving, and I was the one who expressed desire to leave but am unable to do so due to financial and other constraints. Furthermore, why should my desire to leave be kept quiet? If I want to share it with the world, then thats my decision and has absolutely nothing to do with you or anybody else.

  50. Sorry about the identity mix-up, Antiaa. I keep getting interrupted by my employer. Just heard an interesting prediction – that everything would get better for the next year or two because SA under Zuma is going to have to look good to stop more and more people leaving, and taking money and skills with them. After that, however, I think the axe will have to fall. Semaj

  51. Is that right Semaj? Interesting!! The part about the axe falling, I can agree with, however, the year or two of ‘utopia’? can’t see that happening. Unfortunately the ANC, since coming to power, has never shown any interest in trying to stop the ‘brain drain’. Just as they have shown no interest in curbing/stopping the rising crime.

  52. Well, Antiaa, I can only hope you’re right and the the ANC turns out to be as consistently dismal as you think. At least, that way, they won’t fool anyone and people who dream of being able to escape can carry on doing it. Semaj.

  53. Yeah, I can but dream

  54. That`s Bobo`s text below and I endorse it except the last sentence or two.Bobo,I hereby unequivocally and unconditionally withdraw that offending word and I retract my contradicting message wholly since I did some investigation and you`re spot-on about the origin of the tapes.

    I must disagree with you on the DA since the DA`s standpoint on AA its that we did not struggle to be dependent and entitled but to show the world that we have what it take to drive the economy.

    Instead of running to Kebble to go beg we should be talking about making five-million a day like him…The DA believe the duty of a government is to create environment where everyone think of how they are going to improve and develop themselves and doesn`t believe in spoon-feeding people but to teach people how to spoon-feed themselves then let them soldier-on.

    I don`t have a problem with the DA`s Constitution but with individual DA members across the colour-bar born by personality clashes or differences.

    You see,to free yourselves and empower yopurselves you need to raise funds and buy land and buildings in that way you have something that you can claim to yourselves.These aliens use their criminal procceedings to acquire properties and they are enjoying some kind of freedom since no-one can ask them what they are doing at a specific area since people assume they have premises there!

    These tapes never belonged to the NPA, Tim. They were the property of NIA. NIA confirmed that the tapes were recorded during their investigation into the browse mole report. The tapes has since been declassified. The NPA, in listening to these recordings, had to go to NIA to listen to the tapes. The NPA never had the tapes, and still does’nt have them. It is the property of NIA. And NIA has declassified it recently.
    Another correction is that the arms deal was not discovered by the DA, but by Patricia De lill.
    I know you would want to polish the profile of the DA a little bit, but please do it on their merits. They are just reactionaries who are so quiet on issues like affirmative action, land redistribution etc, for very obvious reasons of course! And we know why! But yet they are trying to get black votes, interesting isnt it?

  55. Antiaa,Semaj!If I had the money I would have used my rights to force the government to deliver through the Constitutional court.

    Because the issue is the fact that this government is bypassing the constitution and doing things on its whims and dictations.Well,I am holding my fingers hoping that th foreign votes by south africans outside of South Africa wil;l enable the DA to upset the ANC`s majority and force it to share power or even out it!

    Zile is not stupid …she has done resarch as regards the number of South Africans outside of the country who are elligible to vte and has satisfied herself that the majority accoss the population spectrum wil vote for her part that`s why she doesn`t seem to care much about black votes anymore.

    Attiaa,you don`t need all those to leave your country since options abounds.All you need to do is to take advantag of options available.When Clinton was still th President I wrote to him asking im to scure contacts for me who are in the same field I`m in and he obligedbut then I discntinued the correspondence.That was another way for me to leave the country through invitations and then don`t come back but theres still somethng one can do to stay and force change.

  56. Lekgotla says:

    @Tim re: Foreign votes giving DA majority in Parliament.

    There are only 16,000 eligible foreign based votes this time around – registration procedures would not have made it possible for all externally South Africans desiring to register to do so in time; the elections would have had to be postpned, thus causing scheduling conflict with the requirements of the constitution to hold elections before end of April 2009. This number of eligible votes was comfortable enough for the IEC and the Government not to comment adversely upon! In any event, it would have been quite easy to delay registration beyond the date that the constitution compels the country to hold the elections, thus disqualifying those unregistered on the voting date. In all cases, the eligible number would have been capped at 16,000. One National Assembly seat needs around 70,000 votes. The DA will likely, therefore, draw up to slightly less than a quarter of a seat from the votes, assuming they get all of the votes – one of the votes was cast by Dr. Nkosazana Zuma-Dhlamini as she was on official visit outside the country on the day gazetted for foreign votes. You never know, the DA might still get that one as well

  57. Lekgotla says:

    I hold the view that there is more in common among us than we might have had opportunity to explore. For instance, Zille and Mugabe share the following which must be cause for strengthening unity among people of common purpose:

    1. They both (reportedly) stronglyopposed apartheid
    2. They both (reportedly) support African Union initiatives on good govenrnace (Peer Review etc)
    3. They command the significant minorities in their respective legislatures
    4. They are both African
    and.. you guessed it
    5. Users of Botox

    A little more research may reveal a greater basis for these leaders to collaborate!!!

  58. Amtiaa, Tim, it’s April 23 and a bit early to tell if the ANC got its two-thirds, but there’s something you might be able to shed light on. Apparently, many people refused to vote at all because they hadn’t received something from the incumbent government – houses, electricity, etc. This refusal to vote at all, the threat to simply boycot an election, instead of threatening to vote for another party – which whould get immediate response from Government – baffles me. There is also a persistent belief among rural voters that the ruling party will somehow know what was voted for. I can’t help it. 15 years on, I find this unbelievable. Many people have tried to blame this on education, or a lack of it, but I don’t know. I hope I’m wrong, but I have a dawning suspicion that even educated ANC voters will simply vote ANC-only or not at all. Hope I’m wrong, because if I’m right, there’s not much point to a party-political electoral process. Semaj.

  59. semaj,idf you go to brazil,rio de janeiro,peru,cuba,venezuela,mexico city among others you`ll find the same situation a ours where the government is the only bull i9n the kraal and all is sleeping but the governments spin doctors coninue to spew out disinformaton and propaganda that the governments in those ountries are committed into this and that but the situation gets worse by the day.

    South Africa is ladn with illierat and intelligible voters and this will always leasd to the wrong party ruling.When it comes to an election we need to speak with one voice so that parties don`t et the slghtest chanc to divide us with fvour and promises.Blacks of this cuontry don`t have clue what elections are all about that`s why they are racialising elections by opting for black poster faces even if its etrimental ttem.I hav been preaching here that without political freedom you can`t talk bout economic freedom. since these are entertwined.

    These black elits hav got their partial economic freedom but they are still not happy because they are not appreciated by their former oppressors. The fact that they trek to formerly white areas its obvious that thy still need to free themselves politically.

    Ita pity that they talk so much about Obama nd America but are learning nothing from Americ where its unheard of that a candidate can offer citizens food prcels during elections since Americns go to the polls to go mandate hei governments not to o her hat their overnments will do for them but that they will do what they are mandated to do. However regrdless of ho ins I`m out of here sinc there`s no party that will meet my aspirations.i have sen th da rule in capeon and for me as a blak man its scary.just as the anc admitte it is a one party state the da admmitted that it is a rightwing party and both confessed to the media.

  60. Thanx for input, Tim. I’m still gobsmacked at unfolding election results, but I suppose it’s easy to underestimate to what extent prospective ANC-voting communities are canvassed. A perhaps yawnworthy observation is that the two-thirds majoty about to be clinched by the ANC amounts to 66.6% of votes. Three sixes (666) right? What with the poor and unschooled to brainwash for forthcoming generations, I just hope that’s not also going to be the number of years it takes for the ANC to lose an election. Semaj.

  61. You know-Semaj…!!!If I would have been these blacks of this country I would have been too ashamed to admit in public that I voted for the ANC or any of the black parties since they`re all just a laughing stock since they have no identity nor direction like for an example white or Indian who will make it clear they stand for white minorities or Indians.

    The ANC is a shell of itself which is now more a business entity run along business lines than a political party.What I`m saying its that.. whatever you want from its government you have to pay b means of bribes otherwise you`ll shout and shout they won`t hear you!!

    These blacks voted for their continued suffering in the hands of the police who are deporting them and sending them to pillar-to-post when they need its service and red-ants and police action on marchers and to see them running like mad celebrating the victory of the ANC makes one wonder if are they sane and sober!

  62. I`m reaally dishevelled and perturbed by the criteria of our junior,inexperienced and incompetent media of reporting the elections.

    It class parties according to their financial and membership strengths meaning that the party with the majority members and more money it gets better coverage than the others and that`s why the new parties with no bdget were not mentioned !!

    This has of course reated the impression that the media was the ANC spokesman since theirs was nothing but publicising and marketing it over-and-above other parties.This is something that the Human Rights Commission must look into since its racism and discrimination.

  63. Sane, maybe Tim – sober, I’m not so sure. And the kind of sanity we’re looking at is also weird. I mean, these people simply won’t vote for any other party, regardless of whether it’s the DA or someone else. The mere threat of doing that – as opposed to threatening not to vote at all – would have the ANC falling over itself to respond to whatever they’re not being given. I have to resign myself that the ANC is here to stay for the next 50 years, if not permanently. Semaj.

  64. Semaj, I saw your post to Tim and I happen to agree with you about them staying in power. Remember they are now in bed with the old NP who were masters of staying in power and have also had a good teacher by the name of Bob ‘Mad Mugs’ Mugabe up North. I can’t see them reliquishing power any time soon, if ever, especially when they are able to indoctrinate and intimidate the illiterate and uneducated masses at will.

  65. Yeah, Antiaa, so where does that leave us? The ANC may not have clinched its two-thirds, but there’s only one conclusion – this is a one-party state in all but name. Semaj.

  66. Oh, for sure Semaj. All we can do I suppose is to try and stop them getting their 2/3 majority and hope like hell that the illiterate and uneducated masses get some sense before its too late, though I’m certainly not holding my breath for that to happen.

  67. Antiaa,Mugabe is exonerated of all that happened in zimmbabwe and is a victim of dirty tricks!

    Mugabe angered his current nemesis for banning homosexuality and lesbianism.Homosexuals are capitalists and that`s why this crusade against him is led by capitalists and their media.All these stories about defecting militarists spilling the beans about his armies attrocities its a propaganda since its his army that runs Zimbabwe not him.Its his army that decides his tasks so how can a loyal army suddenly turn against its servant?

    Yes,this will not endear me well with our ignorant and irascible and venomous anti-Mugabe critics but I can withstand any retortions.As for these arseholes at the Union Buildings I don

  68. I’m sorry Tim, but if you believe that, you will believe anything. I suggest you talk to some Zimbabweans and, I mean those still living there not those who have settled here.

  69. What get my goat Antiaa its the fact that we are fighting each other over other counbtries`s affairs as if we dont have problems but we have buckets full oif our own problems but because we are living a lie and in self-denial we sweep them under the carpet!

    Our people are surrendering themselves to Nigerians to be used as mules as a last hope of feeding,clothing and sheltering themselves because this government is impoverishing us by not creating jobs and not preventing unwanted pregnancies and school drop-outs and the proliferation of indigent foreigners and these are just some of our own problems.

    Zimbabwe is more effectively policed than South Africa and is clean and safe.These critics of Mugabe come all the way from Europe and the West to Holiday in Zimbabwe and go home free of crime.

  70. Sorry Tim but once again I have to disagree. I still have numerous friends and relatives living in Zim and with whom I still have contact and they tell a totally different story. On the other hand, I do agree that we have our own mega problems that should be sorted out but try telling that to the government.

  71. Semj,Antiaa-this ANC is breeding street people and impoverishing the ommunity so that it can use them for Zuma trialsrallies and elections b busing them there and this is how ruthless and uncaring they are!

    I was wondering as to why when the police and the D removed them it protested very strongly!These dumbasses have all along been the enemy of black people.They killed jut s many blacks a th boers did.

    All those Soweto `76 students who left for exile did not return implyin that Zuma,Hani and Nhlanhla who were all Intelligence officials killed them through their firing squad,poisonngs,torture etc and here in South Africa it allowed whie cops to live reely and only kill black cops.When they came back fom exile they went straight to former white areas away from blacks and rightwing areas.

  72. Tim, you seem to have quite a good handle on what’s going on locally. A disturbing thought. All those street people being bred here, the impovershment of more and more people, is the generation of more and more angry ANC voters. The implication is that it wouldn’t be in the interests of the ruling elite to improve the lot of the masses, but instead to cultivate them – and their dire circumstances – for voting purposes. If that’s the case, then the validity of what seems to be widely regarded as a party-political democracy may not be valid here. Semaj.

  73. Semaj,in the late nineties when people where aasking who are these people-I set-about researching them and I DISCOVERED SOME VERY worrisome spectacle…these are gangsters who have left a trail of ters,blood and corpses behind and since I was inCapetown i handed my report to them and they discovered the same results and they acted resulting into the arrest of many of them for crimes committed against their schoolmate,parents and communities and parole conditions violations.

    I discovered that they control and rule the streets and that to live on the streets or trade or beg you have to be a gang orpay protection fee so I`m no more worried about street people because I mow now who they are.The ANC is guilty of denying them thirhuman rightsand instead abusing them.

    We are concerned about foreigners human rights but here at home there`s this denial of our people of their human rights by protecting them against being coerced by gangs.

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